Date 20:00 UTC on Tuesday 9 July 2024 - 60 minutes.
Objectives
- FHIR Terminology Services and Resources
- FHIR Profiles & Terminology Binding
Meeting Details
Online: https://snomed.zoom.us/my/snomedhl7?pwd=UCtmRkdHZ3pVNDB1MnJuZmg2b3hUZz09
Passcode (not required when using link above): 32075
Chat: public-snomedintl.slack.com # snomed-hl7-fhir (ask for invite!)
Zulip Chat: https://chat.fhir.org/#narrow/stream/179202-terminology
Discussion items
Item | Description | Mins | Owner | Notes & Actions |
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1 | Welcome and introductions | 2 | Recording, notes & attendance. Check questions in Zulip and SNOMED International #snomed-hl7-fhir | |
2 | Previous Meetings | 2 | ||
3 | Other Meetings | 10 | Recent Events:
Future Events: HL7 September 21 - 27 Atlanta, Georgia SI Business Meetings and Expo 19 - 25 October 2024 Seoul, Republic of Korea Other Regular Meetings: HL7 Group TSMG (meeting Wed PM ET every other week) - Terminology Service Management Group (HTA Thursday AM is now a subgroup of the TSMG). 2022-05-17 RH Joint session with Vocab at last business meeting. 2022-06-14 Group has approved minimum capabilities for terminology servers. Now looking at bigger/better HL7 Terminology Server HL7 Cross group projects : CDA & FHIR Translation Meetings (weekly): Jay Lyle Going well, there is an implementation guide and the group is doing connectathons. May in Dallas and Minneapolis. See https://confluence.hl7.org/display/CGP/C-CDA+to+FHIR+and+from+US+Core+Mapping | |
4 | Document the use of an issue type to return incomplete validation | 40 | HL7 Jira ticket: https://jira.hl7.org/browse/FHIR-44810 The group discussed the topic and documented the discussion in the HL7 Jira ticket: https://jira.hl7.org/browse/FHIR-44810?focusedCommentId=231490 UPDATE June 25 2024: Notes from HL7 WGM in May: Attendees agreed that we'd like more feedback from the SNOMED on FHIR committee on how this would work in practice in all the cases where it would apply to SNOMED CT. Input on whether or not machine processable responses should be supported would be appreciated as well. TBD: Discuss in future calls with Kai Kewley and Michael Lawley present | |
5 | MedicationRequest Question | 20 | There are questions here currently regarding the Medication "line" (medication Statement I think in the international models) / Medication request / Medication dispense. One is, is there a way in FHIR to somehow link two medications to say that people have to take one drug X hours after the first one? How can we in MedicationRequest.dosage instruction express that a drug must be taken x hours after another drug which is in another medication line/Request? Can we somehow group two prescriptions to link them and give "global instructions" for both? Or would that pose other problems? | |
6 | General discussion on work being done in EU | 6 | See https://build.fhir.org/ig/hl7-eu/laboratory/branches/master/index.html https://github.com/hl7-eu/laboratory https://confluence.hl7.org/display/HEU/Laboratory+Report+Implementation+Guide%2C+Edition+1 https://build.fhir.org/ig/hl7-eu/xpandh-hdr/ ML: https://csct.be/projects.html 2023-09-19 ML CSCT now has official "Not for Profit" status as an entity. 2024-05-29 RH The HL7 Europe Laboratory Report FHIR IG will be balloted as a universal IG either in Sep 2024 or Jan 2025. | |
7 | Identifying Modules - is most dependant the right thing to do? | Problem that changing the Canadian identifying module to the most dependant one (French Module) is not recognised by Snowstorm
The "most dependant module" idea doesn't continue to hold when we think about extensions that have multiple, equally dependant modules. Also some external content (like LOINC) could be used by multiple countries and be the most dependant module, but could not be used as an identifier - it would no longer be unique. 2024-07-09 Review the guidance in the extensions practical guide to define how to select the identifying module, even when is not the most dependent module. The agreement of the group seems to be to separate the notion of package composition from module dependency. The terminology server will use the provided module as an identifier of packaged, which contents are defined elsewhere. The extension maintainer will choose which moduleId will identify his package, and needs to make this available to implementers. Maybe this is a use case for annotations. Alternative approach AP: NHS has created a composition module, that is created only for the purpose of referring to the other 5 NHS modules, and be used as the identifier of the package. | ||
8 | Model Binding | Model Binding, specifically model binding for elements within resources (rather than values). Previous binding discussions: Bindings to FHIR Clinical Resources. See also terminology binding See demo which shows various elements in FHIR resources and how those would be populated from a SNOMED concept: https://ihtsdo.github.io/sct-implementation-demonstrator/#/context. but working back from that, we could identify the SNOMED Attribute Types, which are relevant for the various elements in each resource. JL see https://hl7.org/fhir/R4/condition-mappings.html#sct-attr or, more challenging: https://build.fhir.org/observation-mappings.html#sct-attr Also discussion on negation in Condition, Allergy and Family History (see 160266009 |No family history of clinical finding (situation)|) Also on the subject of the purpose and value of putting time into this: if mapped to the appropriate SNOMED Attribute Types in compatibility with the Concept Model, that would allow an automatic transformation to a Post Coordinated concept - or possibly identifying as a Pre-coordinated one. | ||
9 | New Slimline Agenda | See discussion pages for links to archived discussion: Discussions | ||
10 | Problem lists in FHIR | How are Problem Lists (aka concern list) shared in FHIR? PJ Transfers of patient notes / records contain problem lists. Suggestion to use Observations. AP Shared https://developer.nhs.uk/apis/digital-maternity-1-0-0/explore_problems_list.html based on List Resource Background reading: Medical Records That Guide And Teach also "Medicine in Denial" (also updated - "Ending Medicines Chronic Dysfunction") | ||
11 | Affiliate license | Questions around the Affiliate license in Zulip See affiliate license - https://www.snomed.org/_files/ugd/900274_689013e9e0c74d23892abe9caee02612.pdf 2024-07-09 New section in IHTSDO Freshdesk with Licensing FAQs: https://ihtsdo.freshdesk.com/support/solutions/4000002199 | ||
12 | Exposing Relationship Grouping in FHIR | Zulip discussion on exposing relationship role grouping: https://chat.fhir.org/#narrow/stream/179202-terminology/topic/SNOMED.20relationship.20groups Ontoserver uses their own extension: https://ontoserver.csiro.au/docs/6/ext-subproperties-cs.html OWL representation groups explicitly with 609096000 |Role group (attribute)| ALO Since you already have access to the normal form as a property, role grouping could be determined from this. | ||
13 | Asserter / recorder | How should we deal with the situation where the person entering data into some system may not be responsible for the record. PJ See Immunization Performer - each one has an action and an actor https://www.hl7.org/fhir/provenance.html ( fully featured & flexible but heavy handed approach) See also https://www.hl7.org/fhir/R5/participant.html and https://build.fhir.org/procedure.html R6 (unchanged from R5) states: 9.2.4.8 Use of Condition.asserter DK Would expect to see multiple Condition resources where multiple parties assert a diagnosis JL See discussed list of possible participants https://confluence.hl7.org/display/CGP/Provenance+Domain also (DK) see ValueSet https://hl7.org/fhir/R5/valueset-participation-role-type.html Group agreed that the current wording in the specification is unclear. | ||
14 | Introduction to SNOMED with FHIR YouTube recordings of Dev Days Presentations: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=40Lvv2t8OxU | |||
15 | SNOMED Concept Model & Resources elements mapping | Information on Mapping SNOMED Concept Model to FHIR Resource properties Andrew Perry There is info in the FHIR home page: Bindings to FHIR Clinical Resources There discussions in termInfo about semantic overlaps but they were not exhaustive. UK has specific advice about what attributes to avoid. | ||
16 | Round table updates | Belgium Update + TX IG Support Update - authorities looking for independence from HL7 servers, partially due to performance considerations. RH Suggested self hosted TxFHIR.org server code (needs built locally unless Windows install, see https://github.com/HealthIntersections/fhirserver ) available (or Ontoserver of course - as of v6.15). ML suggested: See http://tx.fhir.org/tx-reg/ and https://github.com/FHIR/ig-registry/blob/master/tx-registry-doco.md for alternative terminology server support MAL: Is every FHIR message validated, and if so, against a separate server? RH Having the same discussion with US implementation - unsure of consensus. Group discussion on: if a message fails validation, what are you going to do with it? Quarantine (can then get stuck)? Bounce back (not implemented?). ML Usually systems are not synchronously coupled, so a message rejection is not possible. Watch out for CodeSystem updates eg change to display text for a code suddenly causing large volumes of rejections. Also watch out for text in ValueSet definitions as it can also go out of date. PWI SNOMED-CT has the option to be more forgiving for inactive descriptions. Belgium (via Translation User Group) would like to inactivate descriptions of inactive concepts to help avoid apparent duplications. ML Ontoserver will detect this and use "best case" instead eg most recently inactivated descriptions. See also https://build.fhir.org/episodeofcare.html (unchanged since R4) collects together a set of temporally linked encounters. | ||
17 | Valueset Version Validation issue in IPS | RH: IPS Guide has bindings to value sets expressed with the International Edition version. Validation of content with the Canadian edition fails, even if it refers to concepts in the international edition. PJ: sharing version in the codeable concept is complex for validation ML: using the international edition in the valueset definition is limiting in this setting RH: Version is overloaded to represent edition + release Plan: Not using the version in the value set definition. Verify if the validator is firing appropriately. it should be a warning in some cases. What would be the guideline on wether to include version or not when sharing a codeable concept? Share both your national concept + the closest concept in the international edition? | ||
18 | How to package content IGs with Terminology IGs | ML: The challenge of keeping them aligned DK: we include valuesets but not coded systems in our IGs | ||
19 | FHIR Questionnaires and SNOMED Demo | |||
20 | URI Resolution Update | Requirement to resolve URIs representing post-coordinated expressions. ML Suggests resolving to a page that displayed information about that expression - formatted nicely, diagram? - and perhaps further capabilities, but not go as far as attempting to classify in the first instance. ECL would return implicit valuesets "Post Coordination is modeling and shouldn't be taken lightly" - DK | ||
21 | Incomplete Expansions | Potential for marking the expansion of certain valuesets as incomplete because theoretically, all possible Post Coordinated Expressions exist but are not included in the expansion. See https://build.fhir.org/ig/HL7/fhir-extensions/StructureDefinition-valueset-unclosed.html https://jira.hl7.org/browse/FHIR-40718 DK - flag excludePostCoordinated to include or not include post coordinated values would affect this. | ||
22 | Snowstorm Development Question | Question on the future direction for Snowstorm PWI : Potentially looking at horizontal scaling by separating out country instances on number of services. Considering test suites eg Touchstone. Also support for use with IG Tooling. PJ suggests could look at Inferno (wrapper for FHIR Validator). ALO : Snowstorm-lite would allow for quicker scaling with much reduced memory footprint, with a small number of limitations such as reduced ECL capability and restriction to single Snapshots. See https://github.com/IHTSDO/snowstorm-lite | ||
23 | Update of the Implementation Course - Terminology Services Module | Jon Zammit | Regarding Using SNOMED CT with HL7 Standards
DK: How do we express equivalence now? Should that be done with two complementing simple directional maps, or would we use a complex map with a correlation type of equivalence?
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24 | Alt Identifier File | Peter G. Williams | Using the Alternate Identifier File in implicit maps. No refset is available. Can we use the scheme id? On non receipt of a scheme id, we discussed that all 'mapped' values could be returned? http://localhost:8080/fhir/ConceptMap/$translate?code=254153009&system=http://snomed.info/sct&targetsystem=http://loinc.org&url=http://snomed.info/sct?fhir_cm=705114005 So here for example, is the scheme &url=http://snomed.info/sct?fhir_cm=<scheme sctid> needed? It would cause issues by being looked up as a refset first, and code would have to be ready to fall back to also check scheme ids. ML suggest we need the URL parameter to indicate that the alternate identifier file should be used. Is there a URI for the Alternate Identifier File itself? No. The scheme id is more specific. It is redundant because we already have the targetSystem URI. Could it be used for anything else or confused with anything else if we tried to use it? URI suggestion: http://snomed.info/sct?fhir_alt http://localhost:8080/fhir/ConceptMap/$translate?code=254153009&system=http://snomed.info/sct&targetsystem=http://loinc.org&url=http://snomed.info/sct?fhir_alt
So here fhir_alt follows the HL7 defined pattern as per fhir_cm The targetSystem would need to mapped to the URI (annotation/additional relationship) which gives the URI for that scheme. 705114005 |LOINC Code System|. The additional relationship file will need to be parsed for this metadata which is needed for the FHIR server to perform these mappings between URIs and Scheme SCTIDs. Another Question: the source and target imply a direction and the alt identifier file can be considered to be an equivalence (Equal in R4) R4 (also has Product that could be used to specify the Scheme as a return value, see https://hl7.org/fhir/R4/conceptmap.html 2024-02-20 ML Is FHIR clear itself on how alternate codes should work? Not a problem at the CodeableConcept level (where multiple codes are expressed), but at the CodeSystem level so how would we see it in a $lookup (presumably as a property). PJ Subsumption would need to work in the orginal codesystem. PWI doesn't want to reference things like LOINC codes (NNNNN-N) in the SNOMED CodeSystem because at that point (if we were to add multiple external codeSystems) then we can't tell which alternate CodeSystem it originated in. DK Languages Group defined ECL solution for alternate identifiers including the schema eg LOINC#12345-6, see 6.1 Simple Expression Constraints PWI so that does seem like it could exist in the SNOMED CT namespace. ML So if we looked up that code in SNOMED CodeSystem we'd get back the relevant SNOMED code (with a property of "AlternateIdentifier" as a Coding where the system would be "http://loinc.org", and the code 12345-6). DK At this point we've removed the need to do a $translate operation at all (or do we support both?) | |
25 | IG Tooling Compatibility | Requirements for making a Terminology Server compatible with IG Tooling See Zulip discussion here: https://chat.fhir.org/#narrow/stream/179202-terminology/topic/Terminology.20server.20requirements.20for.20IG.20builds.2E.2E.2E 2023-07-25
2023-08-22
2023-10-03 ML Ontoserver still a work in progress in this area. | ||
26 | Observables model | Michael Lawley | Question on the Observables Model - was discussed in both the MAG and the EAG. Yongsheng Gao currently looking at proposals and next discussion will be at all staff meeting in June. There was an inconsistent role grouping pattern in the observables, and the question was trying to find the reason for this. This is being evaluated. Peter G. Williams There is a decision to move to the grouped pattern Andrew Perry looking for opportunities to contribute to the observables and LOINC modeling decisions 2023-09-19 Update: Direction of travel here suggests moving to have all attributes in a single role group, but preparatory hierarchy movements will be required first - Evaluation Procedures moving to Observables. Discussion expected at October MAG meeting, followed by a briefing note if no major objections raised. AP UK have concerns about problems caused with existing counterparts between the two subhierarchies. UK did respond to RFC last week. 2023-10-03 SI responding to briefing note feedback (including encouragement from UK to engage as a matter of priority). Discussion expected in both MAG and EAG at October Business Meetings. Two Schools of Thought: LOINC style single observable hierarchy (order / result) vs. procedure + observable pairs for expressing ordering and results. | |
27 | Post R5 Concept Map - support for SNOMED Map features. | Concept maps and SNOMED Maps - how to materialize as both R4 and R5. Metadata needed: target CodeSystem URI, source and target ValueSets. Do we assume that a simple map is an equivalence. For complex maps, how are the additional fields represented? Eg in property, dependsOn and product (these are typed). See 5.2.3.3 Complex and Extended Map from SNOMED CT Reference Sets CC Kai Kewley Update 2023-06-13 Now working in confluence Concept Map in R5 2023-07-11 Work being done (ML) around clarity and specification for the parameters used in implicit Concept Maps. 2023-07-25 Michael Lawley and Dion had a discussion on metadata and
2024-02-14 DK Enquired on status here. KK has coded some support in R4 but uses comma delimited messaging. ML Using extension to allow properties in R4 (fully available in R5). See extension: http://hl7.org/fhir/5.0/StructureDefinition/extension-ConceptMap.group.element.target.property See example 1 and example 2 shows multiple groups matching. Demos showing machine processing of ICD-10 rules: https://github.com/IHTSDO/snomed-to-icd-10-mapper https://ihtsdo.github.io/iid-icd-maps/ Discussion on whether or not the Terminology Server should have responsibility for applying the values to the rules to fully identify the correct target of the $translate operation. DK would like to see choice for client to calculate the rules. 2024-02-20 DK Sweden looking for FHIR based SNOMED to ICD-10 map. Vendor had decided against FHIR Concept map and implemented a proprietary solution (although if standard existed, they might have gone that way, and would have been an R5 solution if so) | ||
28 | Expand Alliance | XpanDH - Expand Alliance European Project. Interoperability in Europe, targeting providing 6 x 40 hours of medical interoperability training to 40 students to fill gaps in existing offerings. HL7 Europe (consisting of all HL7 European country affiliates) also participating. 2023-05-30 Submission made (SNOMED International is a co-partner). Response expected by the end of the Summer. 2023-10-03 ML News update on course proposals expected for November. See https://cordis.europa.eu/project/id/101095594 | ||
29 | Language behaviour compliance in Snowstorm | BCP-47 requires a dash every 8 digits so SCTIDs need to be broken up to be compliant. Also the "x-sctlang" is required. Also discussed GG's request to Kai Kewley in the behaviour around language headers and how they interact with the displayLanguage in the HTTP GET request. | ||
30 | R5 changes suggested around specifying language using BCP-47 | See Tuesday meeting item #6 Changes for R5 and check on use of dialect in x form in ECL Specification Appendix C: Appendix C - Dialect Aliases Note that where a language reference set pulls from more than one language, the BCP-47 tag could potentially missing out the <lang> element and start directly with "x-". Options for referring to multiple languages: could be done either with a * (see https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTTP/Headers/Accept-Language#syntax ) or with a comma separated list to indicate a priority order (although this isn't supported by the FHIR parameter (unless the server went out of it's way to allow for this), or use the accept-language header). Use case is in the displayLanguage input parameter to a ValueSet $expand operation
2022-08-31 ML CSIRO attempting to get R5 compliant Ontoserver ready in time for HL7 Connectathon. 2022-10-04 With this page moving to terminology.hl7.org it is no longer subject to the ballot process. Instead a "TSMG" ticket should be created. Daniel Karlsson and Rob Hausam will progress this. Also tracking R5 changes to concept map - see http://build.fhir.org/valueset-concept-map-relationship.html. Peter G. Williams to check SI intention for R5 compliance. 2022-10-18 DK EHealth Working Group on Semantics - discussion on cross border infrastructure based on CDA. Suggestion that it could move to FHIR for new specifications/developments eg Lab Reports. 2022-11-02 RH Rob will check the status and how we can help it move 2023-02-07 RH R5 Ballot is complete. Deadline to complete resolutions is Feb 24th. Expectation to publish late April / early May. 2023-03-07: RH R5 going through QA currently. Some last-minute changes in ConceptMap: RH change in relationship types, new ValueSet to remove ambiguity. Directions of maps (very) explicit. No-map situation simplification. Element name changes. Choice datatypes in more places. ML property, dependsOn and product clarification. E.g. property is used in implicit ConceptMaps based on SNOMED complex maps. http://hl7.org/fhir/5.0.0-draft-final/conceptmap.html 2023-07-11 ML Added UP ticket - https://jira.hl7.org/browse/UP-436 (Unified Terminology Governance Project) | ||
31 | Language Reference Sets in FHIR | All | Mechanisms for working with Languages 24 August DK Added pull request to Snowstorm here Implementation by ML using existing fields and specifying LangRefset in displayLanguage parameter with "preferredForLanguage" code and wildcard Eg https://r4.ontoserver.csiro.au/fhir/ValueSet/$expand?displayLanguage=*-x-sctlang-20581000-087109&_format=json&url=http://snomed.info/sct/20611000087101?fhir_vs=ecl/160303001&includeDesignations=true Oct 5 Release of Ontoserver 6.5.0 which includes support for language reference sets as above.
Next Steps: How to promote - could we present at a Vocab call? (1530 ET Thursdays - may clash with SI Languages call) 8 Feb 2022 DK added Designation Extension into the SNOMED on FHIR IG see http://build.fhir.org/ig/IHTSDO/snomed-ig/StructureDefinition-designation-use-context.html | |
32 | MRCM in FHIR Machine Readable Concept Model (applies to both pre and post coordinated content) | MRCM is needed for writing good ECL and also for writing 'good' Post coordinated expressions. Going forward: suggestion that PJ and RH expose both the MRCM and the capabilities of ECL 2.0 with the wider HL7 and FHIR Communities. See slides on ECL 2.0 here. ML more generally this is a refinement axis which is represented as two things - the attribute and the range of values that that attribute can take.
2022-11-1 ECL 2.0 can retrieve MRCM refsets content, the question is how to return them as FHIR resources (structure map?) Using implicit concept maps may be an option to add operations such as get acceptable attributes or get range (note SNOMED is the only CodeSystem that uses implicit concept maps, wording around that is changing, see https://jira.hl7.org/browse/FHIR-39266 )
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33 | SNOMED FHIR Implementation Guide | Implementation Guide for using SNOMED CT with FHIR. IG Documentation: http://build.fhir.org/ig/FHIR/ig-guidance/index.html Also look at the sample IG https://github.com/fhir/sample-ig see build http://build.fhir.org/ig/FHIR/sample-ig/
TODOS
2022-11-1: No news, check in the next call. 2022-11-15 Suggestion to set page per meeting list to work through. Setting up one or two HTML style pages that could then be copied and modified and then use meetings to tackle more difficult content and review. Finding best publishing location, cross referenced between https://terminology.hl7.org/SNOMEDCT.html Pairings - Kai, Peter, Marie, Daniel, Rob Top Topics
2022-11-29 Example markdown page that could be copied and modified: https://github.com/IHTSDO/snomed-ig/blob/master/input/pagecontent/sct_specific_behaviours.md Work to be presented for 13 December (payment will be made in Glorytm) Peter & Kai - ECL in FHIR (Update: Used https://hackmd.io/ for collaborative markdown editing. ) Daniel & Marie - Allergy & Intolerance : (Update: Menu item added for extensions, confirmed examples are useful and appropriate for the Allergy Guide. ) Rob - IPS
2022-12-13 ECL Page reviewed - MarkDown not displaying the same as it did the IDE, revisit. Looking for some more structure that could be applied to the apparently unordered list of ValueSets (which is machine generated). Any documentation on how to do that would be appreciated. Other IG's we could compare to are : https://build.fhir.org/ig/HL7/US-Core/terminology.html & http://build.fhir.org/ig/HL7/fhir-ips/ ( also http://build.fhir.org/ig/HL7/fhir-ips/terminology.html ) 2023-02-07 MAL work for Allergy Implementation Guide (which the SNOMED IG will link to) see SNOMED CT Clinical Implementation Guide for Allergy, Hypersensitivity and Intolerance 2023-02-21 DK Work done for languages - https://build.fhir.org/ig/danka74/snomed-ig/branches/languages/ Discussion about overloading of parameter for both display language and search language. Checking behaviour around fall-back on displayed terms (eg context specific → national language → English). For example, display parameter being a comma separated list (which has a defined order, unlike repeating the same parameter multiple times (also not allowed in the spec)). 2023-10-16 PWI Update: We had a note to follow up on https://www.hl7.org/fhir/R4/valueset-animal-breeds.html as these have mostly been inactivated and moved to the Veterinary Extension. In following up, it was determind that this valueset is no longer present in the FHIR core as of R5. | ||
34 | Expanding ValueSets across multiple Editions. | Discussion on * version wildcard. (relates to a Zulip discussion on expanding a ValueSet against multiple editions to give a superset?) DK How could we specify the latest version of multiple modules. Answer http://snomed.info/sct/* (ie not specifying the version) or http://snomed.info/sct/*/version/* to include concepts from previous versions. For use in the module / version URI. Existing workaround is to use multiple include elements for each version. 7 Sept ML Sticking point - what do we do with incompatible properties eg active/inactive between two different versions - the most recent? Use case: primarily being able to validate codes that might exist in different editions. Secondarily, being able to validate code received in a historical record ie where codes were valid at time of data entry. 25 Jan 2022: Snowstorm will already look across all Editions loaded when a codesystem version is not specified, eg: https://browser.ihtsdotools.org/fhir/CodeSystem/$validate-code?coding=http://snomed.info/sct|443971000124108 only exists in the US Edition. (See also the History proposals for ECL)
2022-05-17 ML Ontoserver supports ValueSets that draw from more than one version, so you could use that to compute the difference between one version and another. 2022-11-1: DK: Snowstorm does not yet support multiple include elements in different versions for the SNOMED code system. ML: The semantic is not yet clear, how to decide in which versions you check properties, parents, etc. Run separately for all inclusions and join the results. May need to understand better the use cases. Michael Chu - let's discuss. | ||
35 | Any Other Business | 2023-10-03 ML working on registration of congenital abnormalities - is there a way to group disorders (eg as part of a syndrome), specifically in the Condition Resource to (See Condition Related Extension in R4 http://hl7.org/fhir/R4B/extension-condition-related.html / http://hl7.org/fhir/extensions/StructureDefinition-condition-related.html ) See https://hl7.org/fhir/extensions/extension-registry.html also condition-dueto. JC Syndrome is just a grouper name, it doesn't "cause" the manifestations as such. |
Potential Items for Discussion
Description | Owner | Notes & Actions | |
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SNOMED Family of Languages | Impact of proposed changes (eg text searching in ECL) on FHIR. Questions around which language reference sets to use when there are multiple, especially partial/overriding context (referred to MAG for discussion) 8 Sept The FHIR specification does not specify a particular version of ECL, so we assume the latest. Any enhancements added to ECL will be immediately relevant and available in FHIR. Note that these latest additions while targeting descriptions are a concept filter, so display options (language etc) will affect the output of those concepts. How about the filter parameter though, especially since ECL wo (ld allow multiple filters in multiple/different languages.
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Specify CodeSystem in FSH | FSH apparently has no way of specifying the version of a CodeSystem. Daniel checking the ANTLR spec. https://github.com/FHIR/sushi/issues/473 | ||
API for FHIR Resource ↔ Post coordinated expression mapping | API for FHIR Resource to SNOMED Expression
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Looking up an SCTID in an unknown module | Problems when dependencies do not align. Multiple code system resources represent multiple editions / versions. ML: See code parameter to code system search. Should return code systems (ie versions) where that code is defined. International concepts would appear in every edition known to the server. eg /CodeSystem?system=htp://snomed.info/sct&code=12345678&_elements=version
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GPS | See Discussion on Global Patient Set (GPS) | ||
FHIR Shorthand | https://github.com/HL7/fhir-shorthand/wiki https://build.fhir.org/ig/HL7/fhir-shorthand/FSHQuickReference.pdf Tooling: https://github.com/FHIR/sushi | ||
$lookup operation - properties returned | Using http://ontoserver.csiro.au/vstool/ I noticed that both Ontoserver and SnowStorm return a SNOMED CT $lookup property for effectiveTime, which I don't see listed, as one of the SNOMED CT properties in the FHIR R4 specification at http://hl7.org/fhir/snomedct.html. Should we create a Jira TIcket to add this? Completed - https://jira.hl7.org/browse/FHIR-26555 | ||
Use of url parameter | CodeSystem "class vs instance" in url parameter between CodeSystem and ValueSet operations. CodeSystem is understood. In Valueset, url is the ValueSet url for example url = http://snomed.info/sct?fhir_vs= allows for the version URI to be used as stated in https://build.fhir.org/snomedct.html The base URL is either http://snomed.info/sct , or the URI for the edition version, in the format specified by SNOMED International in the SNOMED CT URI Specification. The ValueSet version valueSetVersion is just some string identifier eg a timestamp or 0.1.0 | ||
ECL in the Valueset Expression Extension | Check whether SNOMED ECL is (or should be) registered as a MIME type (as per RFC 4289/BCP 13), or alternatively added to the expression-language code system and value set, for use in the valueset-expression extension used with the ValueSet resource. For example, HL7 have registered application/json+fhir This is useful for a ValueSet extension which allows any language to be used to define the selection criteria for an intensional definition using a MIME type. This group has no current reason to use that extension given the existing core specification support for implicit ValueSet definition and the support within the compose element. RDF community may have an interest. Update 2 June RH: Existing small valueset extended in BCP13 (existing known codes could be published as a CodeFragment). Vocab Working Group discussion ongoing. | ||
Behaviour on Lookup | What properties are returned? Discussion: Both Ontoserver and Snowstorm are returning EffectiveTime which is not listed here (unlike other SNOMED specifics): https://build.fhir.org/snomedct.html
Point of interest: Grahame's server returns a copyright property. Update 7 April - Question about whether this is required / desirable? |
Concluded Discussion
See also FHIR Terminology Services Discussions
Description | Owner | Notes & Actions | |
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Terminology Capabilities | Terminology Capabilities: Default SNOMED Edition for a Server. Suggestion to invite Graham for a wider discussion. Resource is still at maturity 0. 11 August The resource is based on instances of code systems. Difficult to make statements about code systems generally, or specific SNOMED editions, etc. Will start a Zulip discussion on this. Michael Lawley Then potentially invite Grahame for a future discussion? 25 August It has been agreed that this resource will now have maturity level 1 | ||
New parameters proposed for streamlining operation of expand and validate code | Grahame Grieve | 8 Sept 20 Is there a Jira ticket ? Rob says Grahame implemented this. 12 Jan: RH update made to GG Server. Documentation (assuming required) still outstanding. | |
FHIR Server Federation | Use case for fall back lookup when server does not know the answer to any particular question eg a façade server which has knowledge of all services it could potentially delegate to. Aug 25: New capabilities in HAPI to allow delegation to an external terminology server. |
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