2022-05-23 - OBSERVABLE Meeting

Remember recording!

Daniel Karlsson

Piper Allyn Ranallo

Daniel Karlsson

See presentation.

There is an issue with allowing the same meaning to be represented in two different ways, one as a quality characterized by a process, one as a process with some output. Particularly, when representing qualities such as presence it seems to be an undesirable feature of the model if different modeling applies if the presence is characterized by a process compared to if it is not.

2022-05-23:

There is a single pattern being applied in the LOINC tech preview; rate of excretion of some substance:

'Clinical chemistry observable (observable entity)'
and ('Role group (attribute)' some ('Property (attribute)' some 'Mass rate (property) (qualifier value)'))
and ('Role group (attribute)' some ('Scale type (attribute)' some 'Quantitative (qualifier value)'))
and ('Role group (attribute)' some ('Characterizes (attribute)' some 'Excretory process (qualifier value)'))
and ('Role group (attribute)' some ('Process agent (attribute)' some 'Kidney structure (body structure)'))
and ('Role group (attribute)' some ('Process duration (attribute)' some '24 hours (qualifier value)'))
and ('Role group (attribute)' some ('Process output (attribute)' some 'Calcium electrolyte (substance)'))
and ('Role group (attribute)' some ('Direct site (attribute)' some 'Urine specimen (specimen)'))

As the property (rate) clearly indicates that it is the outcome of a process (something happens over time) there is little room for false negative subsumption, as might be the case with the presence observable (as in the presentation above),

• Daniel Karlssonwill provide more examples, including for the LOINC tech preview, for next call

James R. Campbell

2022-02-21:

Presentation of Race and Gender assignment observables.

Alejandro Lopez Osornio in latin america this typically is not recorded, with few exceptions. 

Nashar Karim patient-reported, self-assigned, where is that seen in the modeling? It is represented through Interview technique.

Daniel Karlsson recording race is illegal in many european countries.

2022-04-25:

Re-modelling of some existing concepts, including 184100006 | Patient sex (observable entity) |. See presentation attached.

There still seem to be an (almost) agreement in the group that biological aspects of sex should be kept separate from sociological aspects of gender modeling-wise.

2022-05-23:

There are other standards bodies and national agencies which will decide on this issue. SNOMED International will wait for international consensus and is currently out of scope.

Daniel Karlsson

Next meeting is June 27 2022 20.00 UTC

Agenda: